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ratty

Farewell To Custom Hats/skins

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I'm lost.

 

Is it only the Equipment Manager that's now non-functioning, or did they make it so that you can't see other people's hats in general?

 

It's all forms of attachments, Equipment Manager is just one of the things that broke.

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Well that sucks >.> No more tails unless you skinned them for the halo, or something else.

 

But, personally, I don't see them ever doing a straight-up "Buy Hats" approach. It just doesn't seem like Valve. They're cool that they have special hats for promotions, but I don't think they'd ever sell individual hats.

Blizzard is only able to get away with selling mounts and pets because, well, they're Blizzard. They can blow up an orphanage and get support from the WoW community (a little exaggerated, but you get my point). Their single-unit selling approach has always been inside their usual range of stuff. I mean they don't give you a freaking authenticator in a pack of WoW, you have to buy it. You'd think they'd be a little more sympathetic for their demographic and go ahead and include it in every World of Warcraft box.

 

Anyway... I'm pretty sure Valve is not going to start selling individual items for their games. For one it isn't an MMO XD Plus it just totally seems out of their range.

Besides, it's their game. People invented the system to sort of cheat them and pretend to have a hat. It shows how much they like Valve and their ideas whenever they use it. But, remember, not everyone is going to support stuff like this. It's their game, and if they want you to earn/stay with them till you get a random drop it's THEIR choice. They've probably lost a bit of money due to stuff like this. People don't come on as often so they can get hats. They just join, get in a server with one of these mods, and boom, no need for the real thing. And if there is no need for the real thing, people won't play as often to try to get the hat to drop.

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Well, I *Think* the source prop spawner still works. I wonder if simply changing the height at which it spawns on a player, could be a workaround :huh:

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Well, I *Think* the source prop spawner still works. I wonder if simply changing the height at which it spawns on a player, could be a workaround :huh:

 

Doesn't matter, if it's not parented to the player it's movement will lag. As of right now, if it's parented to the player, it's invisible.

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Well, I *Think* the source prop spawner still works. I wonder if simply changing the height at which it spawns on a player, could be a workaround :huh:

 

Doesn't matter, if it's not parented to the player it's movement will lag. As of right now, if it's parented to the player, it's invisible.

 

Does lag a bit. Label it as a "Crude" workaround for now :(

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What I'd really would like them to do, is to setup their system to only protect the content they want to protect, and allow everything else. This way they have their goal of blocking unauthorized use of official or promotional content, while at the same time allowing custom content through. Everybody wins this way, and it's really the only solution that will be a win-win for everybody.

 

I've thought about this some more, they probably tried, but they could not think of a way.

Even if they blocked it, with equipment manager I could just make a copy of the model as a new file, and use that for a "custom model", and I don't think they could stop that.

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What I'd really would like them to do, is to setup their system to only protect the content they want to protect, and allow everything else. This way they have their goal of blocking unauthorized use of official or promotional content, while at the same time allowing custom content through. Everybody wins this way, and it's really the only solution that will be a win-win for everybody.

 

I've thought about this some more, they probably tried, but they could not think of a way.

Even if they blocked it, with equipment manager I could just make a copy of the model as a new file, and use that for a "custom model", and I don't think they could stop that.

 

If servers go this far for the hat, the hat has to be downloaded again anyway. The amount of servers doing this would be in the minority because there are plenty of custom hats available anyway. And Valve could always opt to delist servers using official content in such a manner.

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Has there been any official response to this? I would hope 1500 signatures would at least be worthy of a hello from them.

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Has there been any official response to this? I would hope 1500 signatures would at least be worthy of a hello from them.

 

No response. But I'll just gather as many signatures as possible and if it ever slows down enough I'll create something really nice and professional looking, print it all out, and mail it to valve along with a nicely written letter, perhaps I'll even get other server admins of large communities to write up a letter and sign it as well. To show them how much we care about the ability to do this.

 

I will remain professional as possible and I'm not going to go out calling valve names or anything like that. Just asking them really nicely and making a good case.

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I'm a bit confused, I'm not seeing anything form Valve that hints, "We're going to sell hats." Am I right to assume it's just random speculation?

 

As for the breaking of equipment manager, it might be due to people having access to hats they shouldn't have, such as Bill's Hat and Max's Severed Head. I understand if they broke it for that reason, those hats were for promotion. They were to spark interest in different games by providing something the average user was interested in, hats. It was essentially a: "Hey buy this game because it's really good. We'll throw in a toy if you do."

 

It acts as an incentive to buy a particular product by being a bonus (keeping in mind that Sam and Max was not made by Valve). However, the main fault on their part was assuming that the user wouldn't see the game as the bonus.

 

 

In short, hats are silly so you should ask yourself: Why do I care so much about hats?

 

 

P.S. I'd also address the other mods being broken, but to be honest they seem more like a minor gripe at the moment. If there's a more input I guess I might consider thinking about it.

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I'm a bit confused, I'm not seeing anything form Valve that hints, "We're going to sell hats." Am I right to assume it's just random speculation?

 

As for the breaking of equipment manager, it might be due to people having access to hats they shouldn't have, such as Bill's Hat and Max's Severed Head. I understand if they broke it for that reason, those hats were for promotion. They were to spark interest in different games by providing something the average user was interested in, hats. It was essentially a: "Hey buy this game because it's really good. We'll throw in a toy if you do."

 

It acts as an incentive to buy a particular product by being a bonus (keeping in mind that Sam and Max was not made by Valve). However, the main fault on their part was assuming that the user wouldn't see the game as the bonus.

 

 

In short, hats are silly so you should ask yourself: Why do I care so much about hats?

 

 

P.S. I'd also address the other mods being broken, but to be honest they seem more like a minor gripe at the moment. If there's a more input I guess I might consider thinking about it.

 

Like I said, I have no objection to them protecting official and or promotional content. Just do so in a way that does not break modifications.

 

I'm probably going to be putting together a nice package to send over to valve (the petition signatures and letters from other community administrators, plug-in authors, etc) to show how much we care about the ability to do this.

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I'm a bit confused, I'm not seeing anything form Valve that hints, "We're going to sell hats." Am I right to assume it's just random speculation?

That's right, pure speculation, they have never even hinted that it is their plan. But they have not said they would not do it either.

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That's right, pure speculation, they have never even hinted that it is their plan. But they have not said they would not do it either.

 

Then the concern should be about, "They're breaking our mods," rather than, "They may sell hats."

 

If there's absolutely nothing supporting the hypothesis that they're going to sell hats, then you shouldn't really cause worry over that. It'd be the argumentum ad ignoratium (not 100% exact though). What's essentially being said is that they might sell hats because they haven't said that they won't.

 

I don't mean to offend, but at this point worrying about the selling of hats seems like an unnecessary concern.

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Nonetheless, the motives are part of the equation. I haven't seen any official supposed reason for making such a community screwing move, so we're left to speculation. It wasn't even in the update notes, we had to just figure out on our own what was happening.

 

Knowing WHY helps in thinking up a good solution. It doesn't make sense, to me at least, why they would take such a severe action to protect the bill hat, and sam & max, they can't be getting that much profit from that. And people STILL CARE about getting the real things unlocked, even people that pretty much only play on servers with equipment manager, they still want their favorite hats unlocked. So the only thing I can think of that would make it all fit is them taking it to the next level somehow, and having equipment manager would just ruin that. And yes I know that these changes broke other things, but those were more collateral damage, I don't think Valve has anything against dodgeball.

 

So if we go with the "they will sell items" theory, Voogru has already suggested that they can just make it not work having a server unlock a valve item, while still allowing for custom items, that would scale with any new items Valve would add, and they can keep the profits, and we can all be happy with that solution. I can say I'd be happy with that too, I don't care about the Valve hats, we have several modelers that can come up with new cool stuff that is better than any DLC anyhow.

 

So if you want to add to the conversation, that's great, but understanding the reasons for things is important to some of us, and frankly we are going to talk about it whether you like it or not.

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Nonetheless, the motives are part of the equation. I haven't seen any official supposed reason for making such a community screwing move, so we're left to speculation.

Knowing WHY helps in thinking up a good solution, so if we go with the "they will sell items" theory, voogru already put forward that they can just simply make it not work having a server unlock a valve item, while still allowing for custom items.

 

So if you want to add to the conversation, that's great, but understanding the reasons for things is important to some of us, and frankly we are going to talk about it whether you like it or not.

 

I didn't say we shouldn't talk about why they did it, I even offered my own speculation not too long ago. All I was trying to say is that there isn't much reason to worry about selling hats unless something comes up that points to it. So far all that's known is that they broke it. I offered the hat promotion theory only because the article details are emphasizing hat entities. The reason why I think the selling of hats is a strange idea is because it'd cause a significant shift in the way Valve distributes content. For something as major as that, more evidence is needed before it becomes a feasible idea. Until then, all we can really do is twiddle our thumbs until something happens.

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There are many threads here where we speculate, as long as its prefaced with "there is no proof of this", I don't mind. Its actually fun trying to guess, then later you can see if you were right.

So I guess I'm not sure what your point is. Just continue coming up with theories like the rest of us, and I'm sure we'll all post a link to any facts if we can find any. I'd really like to see a statement from Valve about this, then we can all stop wondering.

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My point was that everyone shouldn't really worry because there's very little known. Jumping to conclusions will happen, but it's not a reason to start being disappointed with Valve because we were going around their drop and crafting systems. What we should begin to be disappointed about is how their update broke all the other fun silly mods while also trying to help to create a way to keep those mods working while letting them nuke the manager if it comes down to it.

 

Anyway, I'm fresh out of ideas so I guess I'll just wait and see what other people come up with.

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Heres why this policy is fail: http://www.h4x.me/images/ctf_2fort0006.jpg

 

It's still possible to do exactly what they were trying to prevent, the only trouble is, it's useless for weapons. But hats? No problem. It's got some kinks in it (one of which can be fixed, although a little ugly code-wise but not crippling).

 

Not only that, but I'm the only one that knows of the workaround. I can put hats on my server, screw the rest of the community, and I've got a monopoly until someone else figures it out, and this is quite tricky to do.

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This reminds me of the 32-player situation. It was a cycle of starting out exclusive, then someone publishes it, valve blocks it from working, and repeat until Valve gives up an just marks your server as "customized".

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While the customized models were always a fun thing to see, I cant say I'll really miss them. I never had any interest towards hats or so (admitted I do wear them once I get one). But I never bothered with the customized content which for example nom-nom-nom provided on their server(s). I am just a vanilla n00b I guess who is satisfied with stock content when it comes to such cosmetic little things. :)

 

However, I too think that this is just Valve's move in order to start making moulah out of hats that you can get only by paying cold hard cash. They've propably looked at how easy they can sheep people like Blizzard does with World of Warcraft's pets and mounts. People who truly want them are ready to pay for them and this floats game companies way just nicely. :-/

 

Even thought I never bothered with hats, no official or customised ones, I do have to line up with those who are against this change. We'll see what happens. They should just make the regular hats easier to get if they are going to go along with closing the modding capability of such content from their players and IF they actually start to sell their own hats. Some of us, myself included, only has one or two hats (lets not count halo, gibus, bill's hat or such), it would be quite harsh if those who refuse to pay would have as shit chance to get hats as it is right now when those who are sell-outs just push cash into Valve's pockets just to get some bling.

 

EDIT: Not that I'd be entirely surprised that Valve would start this. After all, we saw what happened with Left 4 Dead franchise...

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